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Post by songbanana on Mar 10, 2016 16:16:16 GMT 9
btw sorry Graeme Howard if I came off really strong or like a jerk. I think I was recalling other times people have complained about the system without understanding what goes into it, not necessarily just what you wrote. I definitely agree with you that a lot of it is stupid and silly, I just want to encourage C.LAIR to continue taking steps in this direction (as opposed to "it's your responsibility figure it out").
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Graeme Howard
Dead Stargod
always movin
Posts: 1,411
CIR Experience: 4th year
Location: Gifu
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Post by Graeme Howard on Mar 10, 2016 16:54:14 GMT 9
btw sorry Graeme Howard if I came off really strong or like a jerk. I think I was recalling other times people have complained about the system without understanding what goes into it, not necessarily just what you wrote. I definitely agree with you that a lot of it is stupid and silly, I just want to encourage C.LAIR to continue taking steps in this direction (as opposed to "it's your responsibility figure it out"). no worries! i of course didn't take any of it personally - it's perfectly fine that we have differing opinions on the matter and i'm actually deeply appreciative that you went to bat for us at the opinion exchange proper. i am, however, deeply skeptical of everything clair does and am unmoved by what i interpret to be empty gestures on their part. it's like, we should be looking up to clair. they should be setting an example for everyone on the jet programme, but especially us cirs seeing as how we are often quite involved with our own governments, and i always feel like they're failing to provide an example worth living up to. they brought us into this world and they're like our jet parents, and even though they tell you that they'll pick you up every tuesday and friday after soccer practice you usually end up waiting outside in the rain for a few hours before your older brother has to come and get you. you get left behind enough and eventually you're just gonna start walking home on your own, you know? you just wish they'd stop pretending to care about you when their actions speak louder than words ever could
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Post by songbanana on Mar 11, 2016 9:29:38 GMT 9
btw sorry Graeme Howard if I came off really strong or like a jerk. I think I was recalling other times people have complained about the system without understanding what goes into it, not necessarily just what you wrote. I definitely agree with you that a lot of it is stupid and silly, I just want to encourage C.LAIR to continue taking steps in this direction (as opposed to "it's your responsibility figure it out"). no worries! i of course didn't take any of it personally - it's perfectly fine that we have differing opinions on the matter and i'm actually deeply appreciative that you went to bat for us at the opinion exchange proper. i am, however, deeply skeptical of everything gyomu Gyomu does and am unmoved by what i interpret to be empty gestures on their part. it's like, we should be looking up to gyomu Gyomu. they should be setting an example for everyone on the jet programme, but especially us cirs seeing as how we are often quite involved with our own governments, and i always feel like they're failing to provide an example worth living up to. they brought us into this world and they're like our jet parents, and even though they tell you that they'll pick you up every tuesday and friday after soccer practice you usually end up waiting outside in the rain for a few hours before your older brother has to come and get you. you get left behind enough and eventually you're just gonna start walking home on your own, you know? you just wish they'd stop pretending to care about you when their actions speak louder than words ever could I can see how you would be disappointed if you looked up to C.LAIR like that. But they're not like our parents, they're like the HR department in your office. They helped hire you, they hold a couple 研修会 so you can get acclimated. But they don't actually oversee any of your work, and if your boss is overworking you or decides to fire you, all they can do is hold a meeting and point to the contract. And if the HR general manager is a Michael Scott and treats the HR underlings like Toby, it doesn't make sense to say "well they should be setting an example for the rest of the company" because that isn't their responsibility and you will always be let down if you have those expectations. They're a department just like sales and accounting, and if their 研修会 sucks because Michael Scott decided to turn it into an awkward dance party, that sucks--not because they should be a perfect example for other 課, but because it sucks that their boss sucks, just like it would suck if the sales課長 sucked.
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Graeme Howard
Dead Stargod
always movin
Posts: 1,411
CIR Experience: 4th year
Location: Gifu
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Post by Graeme Howard on Mar 11, 2016 9:33:44 GMT 9
no worries! i of course didn't take any of it personally - it's perfectly fine that we have differing opinions on the matter and i'm actually deeply appreciative that you went to bat for us at the opinion exchange proper. i am, however, deeply skeptical of everything gyomu Gyomu does and am unmoved by what i interpret to be empty gestures on their part. it's like, we should be looking up to gyomu Gyomu. they should be setting an example for everyone on the jet programme, but especially us cirs seeing as how we are often quite involved with our own governments, and i always feel like they're failing to provide an example worth living up to. they brought us into this world and they're like our jet parents, and even though they tell you that they'll pick you up every tuesday and friday after soccer practice you usually end up waiting outside in the rain for a few hours before your older brother has to come and get you. you get left behind enough and eventually you're just gonna start walking home on your own, you know? you just wish they'd stop pretending to care about you when their actions speak louder than words ever could I can see how you would be disappointed if you looked up to C.LAIR like that. But they're not like our parents, they're like the HR department in your office. They helped hire you, they hold a couple 研修会 so you can get acclimated. But they don't actually oversee any of your work, and if your boss is overworking you or decides to fire you, all they can do is hold a meeting and point to the contract. And if the HR general manager is a Michael Scott and treats the HR underlings like Toby, it doesn't make sense to say "well they should be setting an example for the rest of the company" because that isn't their responsibility and you will always be let down if you have those expectations. They're a department just like sales and accounting, and if their 研修会 sucks because Michael Scott decided to turn it into an awkward dance party, that sucks--not because they should be a perfect example for other 課, but because it sucks that their boss sucks, just like it would suck if the sales課長 sucked. i think your analogy falls apart because i cannot image any way this would not make their 研修会 infinitely better edit: i do understand your point though; i've just been so thoroughly underwhelmed by literally every single experience i've had with them that it frankly kind of annoys me when they waste my time by sending me stupid e-mails filled with weird typos (i realized while writing this that i can just block them, actually, so this is no big deal).
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Post by songbanana on Mar 11, 2016 9:46:03 GMT 9
I can see how you would be disappointed if you looked up to C.LAIR like that. But they're not like our parents, they're like the HR department in your office. They helped hire you, they hold a couple 研修会 so you can get acclimated. But they don't actually oversee any of your work, and if your boss is overworking you or decides to fire you, all they can do is hold a meeting and point to the contract. And if the HR general manager is a Michael Scott and treats the HR underlings like Toby, it doesn't make sense to say "well they should be setting an example for the rest of the company" because that isn't their responsibility and you will always be let down if you have those expectations. They're a department just like sales and accounting, and if their 研修会 sucks because Michael Scott decided to turn it into an awkward dance party, that sucks--not because they should be a perfect example for other 課, but because it sucks that their boss sucks, just like it would suck if the sales課長 sucked. i think your analogy falls apart because i cannot image any way this would not make their 研修会 infinitely better
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Post by marudate on Mar 14, 2016 9:17:55 GMT 9
Thank you for the very well-done write up of the conference.
I'm looking forward to the database as I at times want to find people working in specific places and currently have no way to do so, or even know if there is a CIR there! It's just a database (a list) so it will only be useful if you use it.
My sense of their response to the T&I was that they know it's a problem and can't fix it immediately but that it's on the list of things to address. Maybe I was reading that wrong but it was my guess as to the C LAIR staff reaction.
The other takeaway was that it seems that they will be providing more guidance/advice to the contracting organizations with how to use JETs? That's the sense I got from one of the gyomu Gyomu staff in my workgroup there. I think best practices and ideas would go a long way to use CIRs more effectively and not just the lowest common denominator of what will cause the least amount of trouble for the Japanese staff to supervise (i.e. random translations, school visits, etc.)
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Post by むちゃRABU❤ on Mar 14, 2016 9:40:39 GMT 9
I wrote opinions that also kind of answer to some of the things here on this thread. Most of them reflect stuff songb has already said though, pretty much.
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Post by marudate on Mar 14, 2016 14:45:49 GMT 9
I wrote opinions that also kind of answer to some of the things here on this thread. Most of them reflect stuff songb has already said though, pretty much. Thank you, I never saw that thread. Those are important and good points. We could really use best practices to help support both CIR and new 任用団体。
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